Old EA Message Board

Ok Rad thank you,

So I'm going to just go step by step with you and very slowly because I truly desire to understand and be able to apply EA more than anything.

Pluto in Capricorn in the 5th Square to Saturn in Virgo in the 2nd and Pluto inconjunct Mars in Leo in the 12.

Pluto in the 5th= the person desires  to be the center of the Universe and has a mentality that the world revolves around them in some way?

Pluto in Capricorn= restriction or conditions maturation responsibility karma?

Pluto Capricorn Square Saturn Virgo=The transformation of those same restrictions conditions maturation and karma, adding the Virgo archetype learning humility and services to others?

Pluto Capricorn Inconjunct Mars in Leo in the 12th= A karmic readjustment of ones own power center, a restriction of ones own egocentric identity?

Thank you so much for teaching all of us,

Heather

Hi Heather,

This is really not the approach we want to take. First, EA is all about WHY versus descriptions of something. In essence the why of what common astrology simply describes without that why. The statements you made are descriptive in nature. The descriptions you made, as simple as they are, are more or less accurate but are meaningless without the why of the whole in which they are taking place.

The whole signature that I presented yesterday for her, the KEYS, correlate to the root evolutionary and karmic dynamics, that correlate with her skipped steps, and why. For example, the 5th House Pluto in Capricorn squaring her Saturn in the 2nd House Virgo correlates with a Soul who had come through fathers who were very critical of her, fathers that damaged her inner relationship to herself, the damage manifesting as a deep inner sense of emptiness, of never being 'good enough' no matter what she did or accomplished and so on. Such fathers themselves would be typically very powerful figures who were successful in whatever it is that they were doing, and would expect all to revolve around them.

The reason or WHY her Soul created that was to learn a core self reliance: the 2nd House Saturn. Just one example of the WHY here. The problem is that when a soul is a child, young, they don't have the capacity to understand that why. Typically then this leads to displaced emotions of childhood, her Saturn in opposition to Uranus in Pisces in her 8th, that manifests as her Soul becomes ever older. And on of those manifestations would be just like these father types: the need to be the center of attention, to have constant feedback from others of just how wonderful or special she is.

EA is a prism of the soul's evolution through time. As such it does allow for the understanding and awareness of cause and affect within the soul's dynamics equaling how and why it manifests this or that dynamic, orientation to life itself, at any point in time.

The value is in the effort Heather, so just keep moving forwards with those efforts. Kristin and I will help you in those efforts so that you desire to really 'get it' can in fact happen.

God Bless, Rad

Hi Everyone,

Ok thank you Rad, it seems that every way I come at developing my EA skills doesn't seem to work for me 

I am not really sure where I go from here or how I am to finally "get it"

Nothing hurts my heart more then to know that I finally found something real tangible helpful transformative beyond compare, something that transformed my life, and not actually be able to help other people with it. The time I have dedicated to this hours days months and years of my life, literally years of my life while other people are playing I'm spending sometimes 20 hours a day just reading studying and correlating.

I'm dedicated it's not going away it never stops so i will have to find my way through this. Thank you for working with me and everyone here no matter what our skill level is.

Heather

Hi Heather,

It is a matter of sustained practice in order to get it. Again, as you know, EA is about the why of anything. To 'get it' means  to orientate your consciousness to the birth chart, from an EA point of view, to that perspective/ understanding. It is like being a detective in a way. Within this is the KEY of understanding the depth of the archetypes themselves: houses, signs, planets, aspects, and planetary phases. And then apply the EA paradigm to that.

Be patient with yourself Heather, and just keep going one step at a time.

God Bless, Rad

Hi Everyone,

Rad thank you.
So I have another question, Pluto in Capricorn can translate to so many things as you say the depth of that archetype is vast and of course it can mean more than Father figures but in  Chloe's case  the clue to understanding that is that the south node of Mars, Mercury and Venus is in Scorpio in the 4th house, a powerful parental figure a Father figure with Pluto in Capricorn?

Heather

Hi Heather,

Yes, and the inconjunct from Pluto to Mars in Leo as well as that also is square the Sun, itself sextile to that Pluto, and the S.Nodes of Mercury and Mars.

God Bless, Rad

Hi Everyone,

"Ok thank you Rad, so in Chloe's chart her skipped steps being Mercury and Libra in the 3rd and 4th house has to do with how she is relating to others, her family based on her past experiences with powerful father figures?"

"How she sees herself and others and her need to be the center of attention and acclaimed in some way? She is learning balance in relating with others, how she needs love and attention and when to give and receive love  as well as as she is learning how her orientation to those is about her own self worth"outside of others?

Also how do we decern that the south node of Mars Mercury and Venus being in Scorpio and her Sun in Scorpio  in the 4th has to to with another and not herself, meaning when I was looking at those I was thinking that she herself could have been this powerful figure with in the family?

Is this about linking that to Pluto in Capricorn in the 5th inconjunct Mars in Leo in the 12 as well Mars in Leo is Square the Sun in Scorpio in the 4th is linked to the Saturn in Virgo in the 2nd oppose Uranus in Pisces in the 8th?  that feeling of persecution is based on another specifically powerful father figures where she felt persecuted in some way?

The feeling of being persecuted is symbolized by the S.Node in the 12th/ N.Node in the 6th square Venus/Mercury, the Aquarius planets conjunct the S.Node of Neptune, Pluto in Cap in 5th square Saturn in Virgo in the 2nd opposed the Uranus in Pisces in the 8th. And that feeling goes beyond just her biological fathers in other lifetimes: it includes other family members, mothers as well, relationships of all kinds including friends.

Also  whenever I am looking at a connection to the Cancer/Capricorn axis being strong in a chart am I  going to start thinking about parental figures immediately? Then if that is linked with a strong Libra archetype that it has to do with how one is relating to themselves and others based on parental figures?

Thank you,
Heather

Hi Everyone, I just wanted to let you know I have been working on Chloe's chart and will be posting something on Sunday.  It's taking me longer than I thought because I am trying to find the right way of saying what I am seeing in the symbols, and sometimes it doesn't come out right.  This is a new experience for me so I want to take a little extra time.  DDD

Hi All, & Happy Sunday,

A special note to Helena, Priya, Sree and any other Soul wishing to contribute ( Thank you Heather and DDD for jumping in too)

I just wanted to encourage those of you who have participated in this thread earlier on to continue to take another leap and some further strides forward in your learning. You have made great efforts thus far and those efforts are all helping those who read this thread.

Within EA, to further your understanding of Synastry and Composite is so powerful, as we are evolving through our relationships.

and for Skywalker, Upasika,Marty, we always love what you post, just wanting to send a shout out at the relative beginner participants on the board.

With support and here to help as we can in your development,
Kristin

I think the root of Chloe's skipped step is to be related to her evolutionary need to re-live lessons of learning emotional intelligence - to learn how to be in relationship with family members (and by extension, society), as an equal, and to learn to objectively listen to others, to learn to express herself and her own individuality through interacting with others in a more objective, truthful and respectful way.   This would involve breaking free from the expectations and conditioning of her parent(s) in order to arrive at a realization of who she really is, someone who is defining themselves from the inside out as opposed from the outside in.   This is why she has created circumstances in this life with key people through which she can finally learn how to be in relationships as an equal, to learn to emotionally mature and not be vicarious extensions of parent(s) with unrealistic expectations.  She also needs to initiate an inner dialogue with herself based on critical self-examination.


With Pluto in the 5th House in Capricorn, Chloe has been learning lessons of creative actualization, and how to incorporate and establish that purpose within the family environment (and society at a later date).   As a child, Chloe's self expression has been heavily conditioned by the expectations of her parent(s), and the society she has been born into.   As Rad pointed out, Chloe has had powerful, successful fathers who have been critical of her, and have expected things to revolve around them.  With father figures like that, a child with this Pluto placement would have a hard time uncovering their natural (Saggitarius/Fifth House) sense of inner authority.  So, in effect, she stops emotionally maturing.  In order to get the attention, love and admiration she needs, she emotionally manipulates those in her home environment and competes for the attention and admiration of others.   Chloe's south node of the Moon is in the 12th house in Cancer inconjunct the Moon in Aquarius in the 7th.  She has experienced emotional crises involving disillusionment, disappointment and disintegration as she tries to know herself apart from the influence of her parent(s).  She has experienced extreme emotional fracturing and detachment from her emotional body.   The displaced emotions have been projected onto others, with unrealistic expectations and an inability to connect emotionally in a healthy, equal way.  This has all been necessary as she must try to align herself with a sense of self that is natural and truthful.

With Saturn in Virgo in a waning square to Pluto, mental/emotional crises have occurred as questions of why her father is acting that way towards her will surface in her consciousness. Chloe must face questions of whether she is living out her parents' desires for her, or if she working to establish her own inner value system and resources.  Taking practical steps to establish an inner relationship with herself will help fill the hole she feels within.  If we look deeper into why Chloe has attracted these circumstances, we can see that she may have been in a position of authority with the same family members in prior life or lives.  The father she has attracted being a reflection of how she was in a prior life or lives, maybe expecting her own children (now in different roles in this life) to be vicarious extensions of herself, including values, beliefs and lifestyles. 

Pluto in the 5th in Capricorn square Saturn in Virgo in the 2nd and inconjunct Mars in Leo in the 12th, South Node in Cancer in the 12th, North Node in the sixth in Capricorn,  can indicate a necessary self-examination and humility as she comes to terms with how she has been acting out, wanting to be the center of attention and why she is critical of others when they want some attention and why she feels she has to compete for attention.  She must uncover the real, natural origin of her creative impulse, take responsibility for it, and make necessary adjustments in order to make realistic goals and channel those desires in a sustained way to become her own inner authority in whatever direction she chooses.

Chloe's South Node, the resolution node to the skipped step, is trine Uranus in Pisces in the 8th House.  This would indicate an awareness and opportunity to liberate from old patterns of identity association, the conditioning patterns of parent(s) and society, and interacting with people through displaced emotions. This would also include liberation from conditioning patterns based on past-life memories.  By adopting an attitude of co-operation she can work to embrace her unique identity and by extension accept the unique identity of others.  There is an inconjunct from Uranus in Pisces in the 8th House to the Sun in Scorpio in the 4th and Mercury in Libra in the 4th.  Chloe will experience crises as she works to adjust her orientation to relationships once deconditioning takes place.  She will need to liberate from fears of betrayal and emotional abandonment.  In doing this she can learn trust herself.

Chloe has Venus in Libra in the 3rd House which is trine Jupiter and the Moon in Aquarius in the 7th House.  The Moon is the ruler of her South Node which is also the resolution node.  Chloe is probably quite charming,  easy going and natural in the presence of others, (belying the fact that she is emotionally traumatized) having curiosity about other people and being able to talk to them with ease.  She understands this, and the trine would suggest that she is comfortable with others and has good friendships with an equal give and take.  That is not to say she does not still want to be the center of attention, but that desire is less emotionally charged with friends.  If Chloe approaches an inner relationship and dialogue with herself where she detaches from old emotional patterns of identification and expression, with the understanding she is not superior or inferior to others, and they are not inferior or superior to her, she can perhaps start the healing process of that skipped step.  Treating other family members as friends would be a good path to take in helping balance relationship dynamics .  DDD

Aspects from Pluto (5th, Capricorn) - square to Saturn (2nd, Virgo), inconjunct Mars (Leo, 12th), sextile Mercury/Sun (4th, Libra/Scorpio)

Aspects to Nodal Axis (12th/6th, Cancer/Capricorn) - sextile Uranus (Pisces, 8th), square Mercury (Libra, 4th)

Personal value structures (Saturn) must evolve in order to transform creative self-expression into something utilizable to the collective (Pluto).  There's a feeling of safety, and an ability to convince others of her rightness in the struggle to exist (Sun/Mercury), yet this doesn't seem to utilize the connection to Source energy implicit in her chart (Mars).  There is a great potential, when she learns to acknowledge the importance of her own value system when juxtaposed with the value systems of others.

Identifying with this sense of security, and therefore limiting the potential for growth through action and a recognizing for value structure to indeed transform (North Node, ruler).  The ego structure of the past has a habit of using the needs of others simply as a way to paint her own needs as more important, therefore attracting attention to herself (South Node, ruler).  Regarding the skipped step (Mercury), there is healing in recognizing the different needs, and comradely between the variety of value systems that people have.  Rather than seeing her own structure of survival as the fulcrum to existence, she can learn respect the diverse needs of all beings.  She can integrate her talents for self-expression and her innate awareness of the other to help build bridges between people, and our common need to have our voices heard.

Cheers, Edward

Thank you so much Kristin, for your generous reaching out (shoutout)😊😊
I can't see anything essential to say, seeing that others have already put across key factors that I am still yet to assimilate.
But I can't help but respond to your thoughtful gesture and previous encouraging posts by Rad - you guys are so kind to us newbies.. so here is a bit of rambling from me:

Chloe's Pluto is conjunct the South Node of Jupiter. And altho Pluto is in the sign of Capricorn it is still in the 5th and here the cusp of 5th belongs to Saggitarius and its ruler Jupiter.
So looking towards Jupiter for clues on Soul structure we find that it is conjunct Moon in the 7th.
Moon here rules the 12th cusp; rules her South Node and hence Soul's recent expertise may have been in this area. To me this shows a Soul that has an abundance(Jupiter) of deep intuitive(Moon) skills in unveiling hidden(12th) truths. Jupiter also speaks of right-brain intuitions.
This conjunction being in the 7th may show that Soul can intuit the intentions of "others" in its experience long before they even interact with it. This conjunction is in opposition to Vesta in the 1st... perhaps showing how the pain of knowing something not yet manifested in relationships would have driven her to focus on, her own self, and strategies to hold center-stage(Leo). That is why, maybe, the Soul is constantly garnering attention to itSelf.. to distract itself from the disturbing truths it intuits in others - which ultimately cannot be other than its own😊 and needs to be brought to light.
Perhaps the Skipped Step in the 3rd house shows that she has failed to communicate her own inner values and principles(Venus) to others for fear of accusations of being pressumptuous. Becoz she would have been speaking based on intuitive hunches and not necessarily what had already transpired in actual interactions. Venus is also ruling Mercury in the 4th.. showing skipped/neglected emotion-centered communications¿
I feel this Soul would benefit from some kind of reflective writing practice. 3rd lord Venus is strong in Libra and also trining the Jupiter^Moon conjunction. Since Moon rules the resolution node, its trine to Venus could indicate that 3rd house activities could help towards actualizing the Moon's role in completing SNode's tasks. Feels like indications of philosophically nurturing and poetic writings. This way she can express anything at all that she intuits without coming across as paranoid or delusional. Honouring and exposing her own feelings regarding the world mirrored to her, will help her understand, love and eventually fall back on her own strong and reliable(Capricorn) Soul. Venus also rules the 4th cusp.. so writing could also support and nourish her inner sanctuary.. making her feel more comfortable within her own pillars of sustenance and less needy of external reassurances.

Hi Rad ,Kristin

Thanks for your encouragement ......

Here is what that came im my mind on seeing these symbols.Thinking that it is some way in the track of possibilities.

For many lives Chole has been learning the lesson of being equal among others.The core desire that drives this soul is specialness  as defined by society - Pluto 5th capricorn.This specialness as defined by mainstream society can be expressed in many ways.But since north node is in 6th capricorn along with a skipped step she may not have succeed in being in that special level as defined by society.In such a case the core desire may have being acted out by being in relation with a special one or it may have been projected  on to childrens - south node in cancer 12 th.

Since Mars is in leo 12 th the core desire has been projected on to children - dreaming and imagining that children may fulfill their desire . Chole may have used her authority within home to train her children so that they acquire specialness within the society based on her desire- Pluto 5th capricorn square  saturn virgo 2nd.And within this dynamics she may have induced strong competition ( Care and love the one who perform well) b/w her children so that they reach that specialness she has project on  - South node 12th in cancer ,ruler of South node Moon in Aquarius 7th,Venus libra 3rd and saturn virgo 2nd square pluto 5th capricorn.Also uranus 8th  pisces opposite  saturn virgo 2nd.This dynamics of inducing competition is very much part of her soul structure that she is completely blind with the delusive way of treating her children - Neptune Jupiter conjunct moon in 7th Aquarius. With South node of neptune there it looks like the soul haven't learn much from the past.This may be the reason chole at an young age have to face with a brother who cannot tolerate her for who she is - a reflection of circumstance she herself created to her childern.

This dynamics of conditioned loving based on discrimination would have created  difficult dynamics with and b/w children .With Mars 12th leo inconjunct pluto 5th capricorn chole would have experienced disillusion from childrens as some of them would not have performed  to the level she had projected.Within this resistance from children have also added to her humility.All this dynamics may have induced objectivity  about her feel of specialness,where they come from? and thus may have touched her true emotional body beyond social define structure of specialness - pluto polarity 11th cancer.

Skipped Step for chloe ,as mentioned above ,looks like is about her approach to relation within family that is based on conditioned loving through discriminating (critical) others and thus keeping her feel special and in control of others - venus in 3rd libra and mercury in 4th libra also pluto 5th capricorn square Saturn in Virgo 2nd.Since this dynamics is within family ,in the past, it was mainly projected on  to her children ;who cannot easily understand what is going on.Guilt is what usually gets induced through this discrimination - as human beings are not perfect,one can catch some fault in others so that you can have control over other .

The resolution node ,south node in 12th cancer relative to Venus 3rd in Libra and mercury 4th in Libra as skipped step plus Pluto 5th Capricorn,is to see others beyond social specialness and projection especially thosewithin family and care them unconditionally  based on what they need.This will help her see objectively the nature of her emotion and thus to express it in a more creative way that is of some service to society. 

Thank you
Sree

Hi Heather

"Ok thank you Rad, so in Chloe's chart her skipped steps being Mercury and Libra in the 3rd and 4th house has to do with how she is relating to others, her family based on her past experiences with powerful father figures?"

Powerful father figures who were highly critical of her that were themselves utterly narcissistic. The nature of this psychological abuse created a deep soul wounding that left her feeling worthless. This is one of the causes: not all.

"How she sees herself and others and her need to be the center of attention and acclaimed in some way? She is learning balance in relating with others, how she needs love and attention and when to give and receive love  as well as as she is learning how her orientation to those is about her own self worth"outside of others?"

On going skipped steps: yes.

Also how do we decern that the south node of Mars Mercury and Venus being in Scorpio and her Sun in Scorpio  in the 4th has to to with another and not herself, meaning when I was looking at those I was thinking that she herself could have been this powerful figure with in the family?

Yes, but even then she was utterly self centered.

"Is this about linking that to Pluto in Capricorn in the 5th inconjunct Mars in Leo in the 12 as well Mars in Leo is Square the Sun in Scorpio in the 4th is linked to the Saturn in Virgo in the 2nd oppose Uranus in Pisces in the 8th? "

Linking what exactly ?

"that feeling of persecution is based on another specifically powerful father figures where she felt persecuted in some way?"

The feeling of being persecuted is symbolized by the S.Node in the 12th/ N.Node in the 6th square Venus/Mercury, the Aquarius planets conjunct the S.Node of Neptune, Pluto in Cap in 5th square Saturn in Virgo in the 2nd opposed the Uranus in Pisces in the 8th. And that feeling goes beyond just her biological fathers in other lifetimes: it includes other family members, mothers as well, relationships of all kinds including friends.

"Also  whenever I am looking at a connection to the Cancer/Capricorn axis being strong in a chart am I  going to start thinking about parental figures immediately? Then if that is linked with a strong Libra archetype that it has to do with how one is relating to themselves and others based on parental figures?"

Generally, yes.

God Bless, Rad

Hi DDD,

Thank you for taking the time to contribute. Your EA analysis, effort, is spot on. Bravo !

God Bless, Rad