Old EA Message Board

Yes, how about the next assignment?

Hi Rad,

I'm happy with the progress I'm making, but seem to be stumbling over merging all the possible meanings of the karmic signature together.  And we haven't even covered the signs yet!

I'm all into tips and hints on how to do this.  Do we use our imagination, logic, knowledge, guesswork - or a combination of all these?  Is it just a matter of practise - practise - practise!

I have been reluctant to use my imagination when doing the exercises - but after reading what the others have written, it seems that on many occasions what I had written through my imagination turned out to be right.  And I guess that's what these practice chart sessions are all about - to make sure our intuitive process and the knowledge we have gained so far is on the right track - and to learn to put the karmic signatures together through trial and error.

As you suggested, Rad, I am reading the relevant chapters in Pluto I. 

Any help in methodology you can offer at this stage would be greatly appreciated.  I find I learn best when following precise instructions!    (Mercury in Cap, 3rd house)

Thanks for your directions so far ... your correction of errors in regards to the evolutionary stages is especially helpful!

Linda

Rad and all,
it appears that we could go back to develop, and...I also wonder if proceeding ahead will be positive for continuing growth and learning.  It seems that in the future, we will look back and in our hindsight see how to develop more, beyond the depth we are developing now.
I open to either or, but feeling more motivation to move on or perhaps some clue(s) to give direction in development of this past assignment.

Hi Linda,

Quote from: Linda on Oct 19, 2009, 01:03 PM
Hi Rad,

I'm happy with the progress I'm making, but seem to be stumbling over merging all the possible meanings of the karmic signature together.  And we haven't even covered the signs yet!

I'm all into tips and hints on how to do this.  Do we use our imagination, logic, knowledge, guesswork - or a combination of all these?  Is it just a matter of practise - practise - practise!

****************************************************************************

It is really a matter of practice, and also doing charts for others using this EA paradigm because the more you do , the more you learn through correlation and observation. It's a matter of thinking and rethinking the archetypes as written by Wolf in his books. What many have experienced in his books is that the more you read them , the more presents itself. Somehow they are ever new. So, yes, allow your imagination to flow as you consider and contemplate the possible meanings when tying together the whole paradigm of EA: Pluto natal, S.Node, it's planetary ruler, Pluto's polarity point, the N.Node, and it's planetary ruler. As you said you have been finding that as you have done this that it does reflect itself back in the other's analysis. And it's off the mark, well that's my role to show you where and how, and to point out the correction. That's how we learn. So just keep going Linda. You have been doing very, very well.

****************************************************************************


I have been reluctant to use my imagination when doing the exercises - but after reading what the others have written, it seems that on many occasions what I had written through my imagination turned out to be right.  And I guess that's what these practice chart sessions are all about - to make sure our intuitive process and the knowledge we have gained so far is on the right track - and to learn to put the karmic signatures together through trial and error.

As you suggested, Rad, I am reading the relevant chapters in Pluto I. 

Any help in methodology you can offer at this stage would be greatly appreciated.  I find I learn best when following precise instructions!    (Mercury in Cap, 3rd house)

***************************************************************************

Well,the methodology is already in place. It's just a matter of deepening within that methodology Linda: developing ever more fully the totality of the archetypes of the examples that we are using.



Thanks for your directions so far ... your correction of errors in regards to the evolutionary stages is especially helpful!

Linda

You are very welcome Linda, Rad

Hi Bradley,

Quote from: Bradley J on Oct 19, 2009, 08:36 PM
Rad and all,
it appears that we could go back to develop, and...I also wonder if proceeding ahead will be positive for continuing growth and learning.  It seems that in the future, we will look back and in our hindsight see how to develop more, beyond the depth we are developing now.
I open to either or, but feeling more motivation to move on or perhaps some clue(s) to give direction in development of this past assignment.

I feel that we need to develop more of the existing example that we are working with. If you want to do that then I would recommend that you study Pluto in the 10th in Wolf's first book, and Pluto in the 6th and focus on the archetypes of guilt presented therein. Within that the need for atonement because of that guilt, as well as anger because of that guilt. Then apply that to the relationships types formed via the 7th House Pluto. See what you come up with.

Rad

Rad,
Okay, I will.  Thanks for the direction

i feel nurtured by the very presence of this community. thank you all of you for being here.

i would certainly love to continue with these charts. i still intend to develop my last interpretation more as to rad's suggestions. i must say however that im traveling right now and am seldom capable (or desirous) of focusing my energy by a computer or in general, towards thinking. (saturn just entered my first house and is squaring my mercury neptune in the 4th.) so dont let me hold anyone up.

on another note entirely- rad, may i request a reading with you? The opportunity would be a blessing. of course i understand if you dont respond to this.

Hi Ari,

Quote from: ari moshe on Oct 22, 2009, 03:33 PM
i feel nurtured by the very presence of this community. thank you all of you for being here.

i would certainly love to continue with these charts. i still intend to develop my last interpretation more as to rad's suggestions. i must say however that im traveling right now and am seldom capable (or desirous) of focusing my energy by a computer or in general, towards thinking. (saturn just entered my first house and is squaring my mercury neptune in the 4th.) so dont let me hold anyone up.

on another note entirely- rad, may i request a reading with you? The opportunity would be a blessing. of course i understand if you dont respond to this.

Have been thinking about your request. If I do this it would have to be done through email type correspondence versus a phone, and I would also ask you to identify and write down the specific questions you would want to ask which is what I would then answer. Am also thinking that the the 'fee' that I would charge would be something like $100 U.S. that could be payable to Wolf's daughter via the School Of Evolutionary Astrology. I would like to dedicate this fee to EA because of my desire to help in the EA councils efforts to spread this work as far and wide as possible. I know there are plans to try to do another conference again, etc, so I would hope that any contribution I or others could make would help serve this purpose. So if you are agreeable to doing it in this way let me know Ari.

God Bless, Rad

Rad,

Yes I am still interested in doing practice charts. I am working two jobs right now so my time is limited. I will make more effort to participate in writting, I have just been reading along.

Blessings,
Michelle

Yes, I am most agreeable, thank you for this opportunity. What is your email? If you dont want to disclose that publicly, you can email me:
[email protected]

Hi Rad,

I've put this together in point form, using my imagination, so I hope most of it is accurate, and look forward to learning through trial and error!    




Early 1st Stage Individuated

"¢  Guilt will manifest firstly because there is conflict between his desire to be free of the patterns of the consensus society, and hiding behind a façade of "normalness."

"¢  He plays a role in society of what is expected of him, but as this self-imposed conformist role does not express his true need for individuation, he suffers guilt, resentment, bitterness and anger.  A lot of the anger is suppressed.

"¢  This leads to crisis, atonement, self-analysis, and finally to self-adjustment.  

"¢  It also leads him to progressively find work that allows him to express a little more of his uniqueness.  

"¢  He judges himself as "wrong" and therefore punishes himself because he is lying to himself and to others, because he is dishonest in his relationships and within the role he plays in society.

"¢  This leads to guilt then to a crisis of atonement for the lies and deceptions.

"¢  There is conflict between appearing to do all the right things in society's eyes, and a desire to break free to express his individuality.

"¢  The suppressed anger leads to projecting all the wrongs onto the environment;  it makes him very grumpy and critical, and he takes this out on the ones closest to him.


7th House Pluto

"¢  Hiding from society can also manifest by involving himself in a "normal" type of relationship.  

"¢  He may project his need for individuation onto another, by finding a partner who is very together, individuated, and who would accept his "differentness."

"¢  As he is comparing his beliefs and values with others, he may at first parrot the consensus idea of anything which only leads to the realisation of his own dishonesty, then to guilt, then to atonement.

"¢  He will absorb the different realities of others, examine all the parts using his x-ray vision, and derive judgments of right and wrong.
 
"¢  He may partner with very powerful, self-assured, prominent people in personal or business relationships. He can totally lose himself within these relationships by putting others up on a pedestal, losing money in business, giving away his power, serving others too much, and playing a submissive role. This causes a feeling of incompetence and impotency in his relationships.

"¢  He becomes dependent on seeing himself through his partner's eyes for a sense of identity.  

"¢  Progressively, he finds partners who encourage him in his independent thoughts, and he slowly starts to express his "differentness" a little more.

"¢  He may play the submissive role over and over again in his relationships because of the guilt pattern and the need to punish himself.

"¢  He may lash out by struggling to play a dominant role in relationship with somebody he perceives as imperfect or impure - so that he can work on changing and improving the partner.  This particular type of "service" can lead to sadomasochism.

"¢  Relationships tend to polarize. He considers himself "faultless" while his partner becomes the "imperfect" or "impure" one. He criticises and exposes his partner's deficiencies and weaknesses, under the guise of being helpful and of service.  This pattern can be repeated to the point that his partner becomes immobilised and starts to believe they really are impure. This naturally sets up confrontations which results in possible separation, and certainly reflection and examination of the difficulties.

"¢  If the partner wants to end the relationship, this can lead to feelings of guilt, failure, worthlessness, depression, aloneness but also to humility, self-analysis and forgiveness.  

"¢  Alternatively, he may attract a powerful partner who compulsively points out his faults and imperfections.

"¢  He could angrily lash out at his partner, with all the force of the pent-up emotions associated with living a lie, and not being in touch with his own self, to compensate for the feeling of powerlessness and impotency.

"¢  This leads to the sadomasochistic pathology or imbalance in the relationship through guilt - anger - atonement or making amends - dominance and submission - inferiority and superiority - power and powerlessness - criticism and forgiveness.  

"¢  He is not necessarily aware of his power and powerlessness in a relationship context, until polarization and crisis occurs.  

"¢  He will try to find a partner to help him find more meaning in his life.


6th House SN

"¢  He has a conscious desire to be of service to others through his work.  This can lead to playing a subservient role in work relations or to becoming a workaholic.  

"¢  Through his x-ray mind on some level he perceives the inequality in his working relationships yet, due to living a lie, can feel such deep guilt that he is frozen to make any changes, so dutifully continues with the charade.

"¢  This leads to fear of moving forward and so he gets security from repeating the same self-defeating patterns which in turn lead to more severe crises - suppresssed anger - atonement - and finally self-adjustment.

"¢  Workaholism can lead to feelings of guilt if it takes him away from his obligations to his family.

"¢  He tries to convince others of his new ideas in the workplace.  If these ideas are not accepted, can lead to feelings of failure, loss of power, and guilt in not fulfilling his capacities.  

"¢  He is generally aware of his power and powerlessness in a workplace context.


10th House Facilitator

"¢  He could become extremely successful in his social role by adhering to a high standard of conduct, since he wishes to be of service to the whole through an egoconcentric orientation.

"¢  His fear-based consciousness, limitations and boundaries force him to self-purify and to make adjustments in relationships.

"¢  Having to adapt to what others expect of him leads to a crisis around the need to find and express his self-authority.

"¢  Because of the guilt of living a lie, or sadomasochism in his relationship, or feelings of inferiority or worthlessness, he may give too much service to society in order to compensate.

"¢  He may suffer emotional shocks delivered by parents, children or spouse that force deep self-examination.  He may neglect his children or marriage due to career obligations.

"¢  He has a need to retain his position in society.  He will try to stop anyone usurping his power.  This may also lead to abusing his position through dishonesty which in turn will lead to a fall from grace, crisis, atonement, etc.

"¢  He may partner with very powerful, self-assured, prominent people in society whom he wishes to emulate.  He can totally lose himself within these relationships, put others on a pedestal, give away his power, serve too much, be controlled by, and play a submissive role.

"¢  If he is unable to live up to his own expectations of perfection in his career, he could suffer guilt with a profound inhibiting effect where he feels he does not deserve anything beyond what he already has.

"¢  He may find himself in a state of perpetual crisis and guilt due to not being able to fulfil his personal capacities or abilities in his career.

"¢  He could feel victimized and blame "society" by projecting all the wrongs onto the environment.

"¢  An example could be that he "supports" the Greens party, by voting for them at Elections, but will tend to keep his vote a secret to himself, and certainly would not share this information with his mainstream friends.  

"¢  Examples of a career could be nurse, carer, nutritionist, physiotherapist, osteopath, or relationship counsellor - but usually in a mainstream institution.

"¢  He may be unable to actualize his goals through his own efforts if he invests too much of himself into his partner/relationship by seeking their approval or self-validation first.

"¢  Self-judgment of right and wrong can turn sadomasochistic tendencies around once reality sets it, leading to true humility and positive change to all types of relationships.

"¢  He is aware of his power and powerlessness in a societal context.



After I receive your response, Rad, I will work on 12th House NN, and 2nd House Facilitator.

Thanks,
Linda

Hi Linda,
Very good summary of the core dynamics of this configuration. So go ahead and to the polarity points now. Bravo.

Rad

Quote from: Rad on Mar 24, 2009, 01:26 PM
Hello All,
I was wondering if some of you would like to do some practice charts utilizing the EA paradigm ? If so, please respond to this post and let me know. Rad

Hi Rad, is it possible to add myself as one interested in analyzing practice charts via the EA paradigm?  I am not a total beginner, and I still have much to learn regarding EA perspective.  I have both Pluto books and have been rereading them of late.

Thanks for the consideration, and if not, maybe the next time around.

Wendy

Hi Wendy,
You are more than welcome to join us in these practice charts. If you have read through this thread, which I am sure you have, you will see that the EA paradigm that we are currently working on. So, for now, I would suggest you read through these posts and the go ahead and develop your own analysis of the current paradigm that we are working on. Ari is going to redo parts of his, Bradley will be expanding on what he already wrote, and Linda will be adding to her own. So the timing is just right if you want to jump in now.

Rad

Yeah Wendy!  Welcome-

hey all, life has been so busy, like so many of us, very close to reposting.
if i don't make it tomorrow night, i'll be unavaiable for a few days, so...if not sooner, later.
many thanks for you all here,
b